Joining us today is Eugene Trufkin, owner of Trufkin Athletics and author of "Laws of Aesthetics" and the “Anti-Factory Farm Shopping Guide”. In this episode of the Better Human Podcast, Eugene and Colin go over the industrialization of farming and how it negatively affects our health, how to provide yourself with well sourced, nutritious food and much more. Tune in now!
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BH 119 FINAL
[00:00:00] Eugene Trufkin: [00:00:00] Sometimes a lot of people would go like, Oh, well I buy my stuff from a local small farmer. So that's great. I mean, you're supporting your local ecosystem, you know, keeping the money in that ecosystem. That's great. And everything, but once again, you have to remember that just because they're, self-employed in a small farmer doesn't mean they're actually good at it.
[00:00:31] Jean. Thanks for coming on the show. Yeah. Thank you for having me Colin. It's great to finally meet you. I've seen your brand around for a while and I'm like,
[00:00:39] Colin Stuckert: [00:00:39] okay. It means a lot to me when I hear that, you know, I really appreciate that. And it's. Yeah, this Internet's amazing thing. I feel like half the time we don't realize people are watching or listening because they had made, maybe they don't tell us.
[00:00:50] Right. We don't get that feedback, but they are. And that's why doing stuff like this and put his message out there. Like even if it really affects one in 10 people, I mean, stack and spiral, you know, paid for forever. Right. So tell me a little bit about what you're doing and maybe just like a quick synopsis of the background, because really, I just want to dive into the, to the crux of what we're gonna talk about today.
[00:01:12] Eugene Trufkin: [00:01:12] Yeah. So like a quick introduction. I mean, I was born on a biodynamic farm in Ukraine, you know, for your listeners that don't know what that is. Biodynamic farming is what they actually have probably a mental image of when they think of farming, you know, like huge open landscape, a lot of different animals, small family living there and [00:01:30] sustaining itself, et cetera, et cetera.
[00:01:32] And basically I moved to the U S and I thought like everyone was farming that way. Including, like all this stuff, all the food they sold at Costco, or like at Walmart, I'm like, Oh, everyone farms by dynamically. This is amazing that the U S could produce so much food organically. I don't even know like what synthetic biocides were antibiotics or steroid beta agonists, whatever the laundry list is very long in terms of the chemical inputs, the net, uh, agricultural industry.
[00:01:58] So once again, thinking like all the food is produced biodynamically very organically, uh, then maybe like, Probably at this point, like four years ago, maybe four and a half years ago, I ran into a presentation. Paul Chek was giving and he's kind of like a world renowned holistic health expert. Yeah. Paul checks.
[00:02:14] Great. Yeah. Yeah. I ran into one of his YouTube videos called nutrition, the dirt facts. And then he quickly outlined like the stark contrast between, you know, industrial agriculture versus like what he was promoting, what he was promoting was bio biodynamic farming. Very similar to what we did in Ukraine.
[00:02:32] And at that point that's when I kind of like what uncle woke up from the matrix and I'm like, Oh man, these 50 eggs, I was buying at Costco for like a dollar 50. You're telling me they're not organically grown or that the hands aren't outside. And on the past 24 seven. So I kind of woke up from quote unquote, like the matrix at that point.
[00:02:51] And that's actually when the, all the confusion began. So the topic of this podcast where we can cover is basically like, even for people that [00:03:00] are health conscious in the States that do want to improve their health, a tremendous amount, it's gotten like extremely confusing. And I would say like almost impossible to actually source high quality food in the States, even when your intention is to do that.
[00:03:14] So like, for example, let's just say a person wants to transform their health. They go to a, they go to a dietician and the dietician tells him something as innocent as, you know, make sure you include more free range, organic chicken in your diet among like a myriad of other variables that the guy would probably suggest as well, like.
[00:03:33] Okay. So let's kind of take that information and let's see what, like the average person in America would do with that information in terms of applying it. So the average person, like basically 99.8% of people would go to their local supermarket, whole foods, probably being the best example of the supermarket and then Costco, although all those other places, Walmart as well, and they'll go in there and it's, it's easy to find free range, organic chicken, and it sounds great, you know, it's free range.
[00:04:00] So in the customer's mental image, they have like just chickens running around 24 seven outside. It says organic. So that means. It's exactly how nature intended it to grow, basically how the head would grow without people even being around, et cetera, et cetera. And they would purchase that chicken without even questioning it at all.
[00:04:18] And basically let's kind of dive into, and this happens with every single food group we can touch on a myriad of different food groups. I'm just using poultry as an example, because it's a very popular approaching to buy in the States [00:04:30] far more popular than beef. And the person will buy this pretty much their whole entire life thinking.
[00:04:34] It's kind of giving them, optimizing their health, you know, decreasing inflammation, et cetera, et cetera. So let's kind of dive in into what free range and organic even means these days in terms of poultry. So first and foremost, like when you see free range, like industry free range basically indicates that there is about like 1.5 to two square foot of space per head.
[00:04:55] So typically what you'll see in a free range operation is the huge warehouse type building. And they have like a small little concrete patio with a very small access door to that outside where the hands get to basically roam free outside, given weather restrictions, et cetera, et cetera. Oftentimes honestly, like if you go to any of these operations and this is industry norm, what you'll see is basically out of the 30,000 hens indoors, like maybe like 50 of them would be outside in the small little concrete patio.
[00:05:27] Uh, so basically what happens when you're, when you have that type of operation, when you're not taking the hands to the food, such as in a rotational grazing type operation, if they're left outside, for example, You have to bring the food to the hands. So basically what are, what are they feeding these, uh, these hands they're feeding them like a tremendous amount of grain.
[00:05:48] And the thing is on the labels, these, uh, these companies aren't lying to you, they're actually telling the truth. They do say like in basically a small font at the bottom, they do save vegetarians, right?
[00:05:59] Colin Stuckert: [00:05:59] They [00:06:00] eat a plant based diet.
[00:06:01] Eugene Trufkin: [00:06:01] They do say vegetarian fed. I mean, obviously the average consumer in the U S.
[00:06:07] Uh, because of Netflix, documentaries and other forms of the under, they think like vegetarians are the apex of health, but I have nothing against vegetarians. I'm pretty sure you'll find a handful of very healthy vegetarians, but they're using it kind of like, you know, very deceptive manner under this situation think, Oh, okay.
[00:06:22] These hens are vegetarians. That means they must be healthy because I saw this Netflix documentary and everyone on there was definitely healthy. Vegetarian fed in terms of poultry production really means is they're grain fed. Yep. And the problem with that, the next question is the problem with that, or it'd be like, Oh gee.
[00:06:39] And why does it matter if just the hens are grain fed? What does it matter? Especially since it's organic rapists? Well, it matters a lot because hens or poultry in general, they're not vegetarians. They're omnivores. Yep. They're supposed to eat like bugs, insects, random stuff off the ground. You could supplement with grains of course, but their diet shouldn't be predominantly just all grains.
[00:07:03] And when you do see vegetarian fed it basically also indirectly tells you that it's a confined operation. It's a factory farm type of scenario. Because if they were truly allowed outside to roam free, what would they be doing? There'll be eating bugs, there'll be eating insects, et cetera, et cetera. And they wouldn't be able to be classified as vegetarian fat.
[00:07:24] So you can see they're actually telling us consumer the trail. Yeah. And the sneaky way. Yeah. Yeah. They're [00:07:30] doing it in a very sneaky way as well. And then since it's this category we're talking about, you know, organic free range chicken, which is the best you're going to find at the grocery store. Like half of the grains that the U S gets actually comes from overseas, come from very, very corrupt places like Ukraine, Turkey.
[00:07:49] Okay. And the corruption doesn't actually happen at the farmer level. Let's say in Turkey, the farmer uses a lot of biocides, glyphosate being very popular to use on grains. For example, And at the broker level, they just basically, before they ship it and switch up the paperwork a little bit and then, uh, basically ship it in as organic agreement.
[00:08:10] It's not organic, right? Yeah. It's not organic. And this is a very common problem. I talked to Joel, Salatin a lot about this problem as well. There isn't quite a solution for it yet. And that's basically 50% of the grains. The Washington post did a really good, a really good article on this, on this issue.
[00:08:26] So now you have problems with the poultry not being fed a species specific diet. So this offsets the basically natural omega-3 to Omega six ratio basically shoots the Omega six way up through the roof. We'll make it three. So if a person is already highly inflamed, once again, this is just another food group.
[00:08:47] That's adding inflammation to their body. And once again, they're going to the grocery store with the intention of actually improving their health. And that's what products are marketed out. And then you add [00:09:00] also now, possibly even with organic products, it might not be organic grains that are fed to the poultry.
[00:09:07] So now you're getting synthetic biocides residue of synthetic biocides in the meat, in fibers of the upholstery as well. So that obviously, you know, the average American newborn for an urban environment is already born with trace amounts of 200 different pesticides. Or 200 different chemicals rather in their blood stream, you know, that's constantly in there brewing and who knows what?
[00:09:30] There are no studies that obviously just the safety of 200 random, 200 different. Yup. Yeah, exactly. So you'd have compounding effect. And then also when you crowd animals are not well-known subject and I actually didn't even know about this subject. I was introduced to it by Terry Cotran, the author of the Wildatarian diet, great book as well.
[00:09:53] And that's basically when you jam pack, uh, any kind of animal into a confined a situation, what happens is there are three variables that lead to chronic inflammation in that kind of role. So one, obviously the overcrowding scenario, it causes a lot of stress. They're shoulder to shoulder. There's no privacy, no room, et cetera, et cetera.
[00:10:15] That causes a tremendous amount of stress too. There's obviously when you have a confined situation, there's a lot of fecal matter and bacteria everywhere. So their immune system is constantly on overdrive, trying to fight off all this bacteria that causes a lot of [00:10:30] inflammation. And then also actually a lot of the vaccines given to the animals.
[00:10:34] Cause a lot of inflammation as well. So you have these three variables producing chronic inflammation in the animal. And when the animal is chronically inflamed, basically the liver produces too much serum, amyloid, a proteins, and in small amounts, it's actually totally fine because basically it's a soluble protein and breaks up in the body and actually serves a function in the body.
[00:10:56] But what happens when it's chronically produced basically pieces of those serum amyloid proteins. Are done, uh, broken off, into emulate a protein. So AA amyloids, which they're referred to, and these are insoluble proteins that basically form us plaque around origin tissue. And as well as to a smaller extent, the muscle tissue of the animal, and it could be, uh, like a specific organ or it could be systemic as well.
[00:11:23] And through various mice feeding studies, they did show that when mice fed meat or products tainted with AA amyloids, they also developed. Hey amyloids around their organs and muscle
[00:11:34] Colin Stuckert: [00:11:34] tissue. What you eat? I think it's pretty safe. Uh, you know, heuristic, you are what you eat, so it's okay. So chicken one example, it's very industrialized.
[00:11:43] I mean, you have, you have pork, you have beef. Let's just assume that we know there's a scale of quality. Right. Like, obviously the bigger you go, this is kind of always been the heuristic. I kind of recommend people like the bigger the company, the more mass produced. It's very, very unlikely. Anything is doing you any favors because I mean like [00:12:00] profit margin and scale and speed.
[00:12:01] Like these are just not conducive to healthy food for healthy humans. Right. That's kind of like the hero story here. So if we're thinking about like mass produced cheap Walmart eggs to like, then we go to even Costco organic eggs, which they do the things you talked about, where they try to make it seem better than it is.
[00:12:16] Then we're going to go to like, I guess, I guess here in HEB, in Texas, we have like, Kind of local free range eggs, but then there, but it's kind of big for Texas. So I wonder what they're doing. And then I can go down to like find these eggs that are from small farms around here, where the chickens are probably just running around.
[00:12:34] Right. So like we, if we, if we, how do we think about the primary. Meat products. I just focused on meat for now because that's like a big part of in my audience's diet, my diet as well. And you know, like eating unhealthy animals is going to really disrupt your biology. Right. So if like beef, chicken, pork, maybe we can do seafood.
[00:12:52] I don't know. I don't know as much about seafood. I don't know if that's as much of a corrupt thing, but I just go with wild caught. So that's the best I can do. How can people start, like simply thinking about this so that if they are on the store and they can just like make kind of easy decisions. Based on like, is it bigger, more, mass-produced avoid it.
[00:13:11] Right. And like maybe safe middle area where they want to make some compromises. And then the best, like, how do we think about how to make these better decisions and what to look for?
[00:13:19] Eugene Trufkin: [00:13:19] Yeah. So I guess in short, you know, like with poetry, you have no label. Yeah. Cage-free so completely useless. Cage-free you definitely want to stay away from that free [00:13:30] range.
[00:13:30] In my opinion, you want to stay away from that as well. And then you have a pasture raised. So you see that not so much in poultry meat products in the grocery store, you see it more on egg products. So obviously pasture raised, there are various levels of integrity of pasture-raised operations. So sometimes a lot of people would go like, Oh, well, I buy my stuff from a local small farmer.
[00:13:51] So that's great. I mean, you're supporting your local ecosystem, you know, keeping the money in that ecosystem. That's great and everything, but once again, you have to remember that just because they're, self-employed in a small farmer doesn't mean they're actually good at what they do. Right. Like, for instance, you can go to a small farmer nearby and let's just say they have, you know, a quarter of an acre of land and they have, since we're talking about poetry, like a bunch of poetry there, so quarter an acre of land, we'll see how like 300.
[00:14:17] Chickens on there. They're going to eat up everything on that ground in like a few days, if not a day. Okay. Hens wake up. And they basically they're like, as Joel Salatin would say, like the perfect worker, they get up, they eat all day and then they go to sleep exactly at 6:00 PM and then they wake up and do the same exact thing.
[00:14:35] So they're constantly scavenging, staunch, constantly forging. So if you're not constantly rotating them on to fresh pasture, almost daily. They just ended up depleting the resources in that land. And then what happens? The farmer has to bring inputs in to feed the poultry grains. So once again, you run into an operation that's heavily dependent on grains.
[00:14:55] It wants again, shoots the Omega six way up in relation to Omega three. [00:15:00] Oftentimes what I found with small farmers is. A lot of them would say they use non-GMO grains, but they don't necessarily use organic grains. So that that's a problem as well, because now once again, you're getting the size of the meat and some people would counter that and they say, well, you know, these quantities are, are so small.
[00:15:21] They're so small Eugene, like what does it matter if I get like one part per million of like glyphosate or atrazine or whatever, uh, et cetera, et cetera, what does that matter? And. There's a really good book on this called the myths of safe pesticides by Andre Lu. And he's kind of like the guru in this area.
[00:15:38] And he's been investigating, uh, chemical agriculture for like, I don't know, 20 or 30 years at this point. And there basically like three myths that make it acceptable for people to consume product that they know have trace amounts of various pesticides. And we can talk about in terms of crop reduction in, in this area, because it all ties back to make it into the grain that then again, those hens eat and it makes it into the nutritional profile of the meat and an Oregon content of those hens.
[00:16:05] So first and foremost, like people just presume right off the back. That these pesticides used on food are tested for safety. So contrary to popular belief, like a complete formulation of a chemical compound in the U S is never required to be tested for safety before being used on actual crop production that people end up eating.
[00:16:27] Hmm. So what ends up happening is basically [00:16:30] this, like in any ingredient, you know this, and I'm talking more over to your audience here, but in any ingredient, uh, basically how active ingredients and then inactive in our ingredients. So the active ingredient is like the main guy. They, they do most of the work, but then the inner or inactive ingredient are basically supporting the ingredients that increase the potency and lethality, and also the duration of that main ingredient.
[00:16:54] So what's required to pass safety testing in the U S for pesticides that are used in agriculture is basically they test the active ingredient in isolation on its own. That's it. They never test the complete formulation like ever. It's just the active ingredient on its own in isolation. And then you have to remember in any crop production cycle, you have a myriad of different chemicals that are being used.
[00:17:20] Not just that one active ingredient in isolation. And so when you have a myriad of different complete formulations that are used on the same crop in any one given season, So that's, that's already troubling. And then once again, like I mentioned, in the beginning, the average newborn in America is already born with trace amounts of 200 different chemicals in there.
[00:17:38] And there's no safety testing done on what these myriad of chemicals do to your body, to your central nervous system, to your physical body, whatever, all brewing in there all at the same time as this cocktail. And the other one is basically like with, especially like vegetables. A lot of people are like, Oh, I could just like wash it off.
[00:17:56] Like who cares if I buy non-organic [00:18:00] apples or whatever other fruit or vegetables. And the truth of the matter is, is actually most pesticides used in agriculture are systemic pesticides. So they're meant to be actually soaked up by the roots. Of the plant and actually become embedded as part of the nutritional profile prop.
[00:18:18] And actually that's where the book, majority of the pesticides sit not on the surface. So often times people would wash it off and they maybe wash it off like 10% of the total content of the pesticide residue that's found in that specific crops. So that's another big myth that lets people continue that, that purchasing practice.
[00:18:36] And then the other one is like, Oh, you know, it's like, I can't even like visually see these pesticides on the crop. I used to give grocery store tours, often teaching people about food production practices and how get that one quite often. And what people have to understand is a lot of these chemicals, even in one part per trillion, which is basically one drop in three size swimming pools has an impact on your physiology.
[00:19:01] And you're not once again, getting just that one chemical, you're getting like exposed to a cocktail of chemicals from your environment and food all day, every day, all the time, three meals a day, or at least the entrepreneur I would say, would eat, you know, and well, going back to the poultry subject, that all makes it back to the nutritional profile of the meat.
[00:19:22] You're eating. And then obviously, you know, there's the whole monocropping issue when you're growing a single crop on acre after acre, [00:19:30] after acre of land. It obviously depletes I've forgot the author that gave this idea. It's not mine. Oh, with microbes. I forgot the name of the book. I just want to make sure I give credit where it's due.
[00:19:40] When you look at an Apple, for example, when you shave off 70% of the surface of the Apple, that's pretty much like ocean. And then when you shave off, like another 15% of the surface of the Apple that's land that cannot be farmed for crops, it's just, there's nothing back to grow there. And then the remaining is basically, uh, Lisha say 10% or so is where metropolitan areas are built.
[00:20:05] So they're built often on the most fertile ground. Okay. So then basically your leftover with give or take like five to 8% of the Hertz mass, that's able to be farmed for crops. And then what's destroying the environment these days, basically like automobiles and then industrial agriculture. Those are the do big culprits.
[00:20:24] And when you grow like a single crop on acre after acre, after acre, after acre, which doesn't happen anywhere in nature, it basically depletes that soil of the specific nutrients required for that specific crop, because there's no rotation of crops. So usually what happens is the sun hits, uh, basically.
[00:20:43] Uh, the sun hits the plant. Then the plant converts it into sugars that are fed to a specific ratio of bacteria and fungi. The den attract a specific ratio of micro organisms, protozoa, nematodes, earth, worms, et cetera, et cetera, that all act to feed the plant, [00:21:00] basically. So when the earthworms either a casing or when the protozoa die, it all gets soaked up basically by the Phenergan, which has a symbiotic relationship with the roots.
[00:21:08] Of the plant, which then make it into the nutritional profile of the plant when you're just growing one plant year after year after year in that same exact plot of land, it depletes that land of specific nutrients that, that specific plant needs. So what happens then? The plants become weak. What does nature do to get rid of weak plants?
[00:21:28] Nature sends it in pests. Pests are nature's way of getting WIC, weak plants. If you don't have weak plants, if you don't have poor farming systems, PEs won't come around. Pest only come around for weak and dying plants. So what happens when the PEs come around? Yeah. If you use pesticides. Yeah. If you're not going to change your farming practice, obviously rather, if you're not going to change the belief system that led to all those problems to begin with, your only solution is symptom management.
[00:21:53] So let's center management and industrial agriculture, just chemicals. So they're going to score a lot of pesticides or whatever other biocides on the ground. Which are going to destroy the microorganisms even more, which are going to make that cycle even worse the next season around. So then they have to bring more chemicals in and eventually you just killed the soil.
[00:22:11] Now you just have dirt. All of a sudden you can't grow anything there. So remember you only have like 5% of, of the land. That's able to be farmed for crafts. So that's extremely troubling, but how it relates to the poultry subject is now you're taking these crops that are deficient in various nutrients.
[00:22:29] Feeding [00:22:30] them brains that are deficient in various nutrients, rather feeding them to the poultry, those poultry. Aren't getting those nutrients either. They just can't come up with nutrients out of nothing. They have to get it from something. And if they're a source of food is also devout of various nutrients, you're not going to be able to find that in poultry.
[00:22:45] And in fact, Joel Salatin did an experiment. I think in 2013, if I'm not mistaken where. He basically tested Joel saltine is kind of like more of a biodynamic farming. He's been on the show. Yeah. Okay, cool. Yeah. So, um, basically he had his eggs compared to industrially.
[00:23:04] Colin Stuckert: [00:23:04] I remember him talking about this.
[00:23:05] Eugene Trufkin: [00:23:05] Yeah. And I forgot the exact numbers, but basically in every single micronutrient, it could have been like hundreds of percentage points greater in terms of the physics. So a lot of people think like, Oh, I'm just getting like two or 3% more vitamin a. I think in his case, it was like 700% more vitamin a versus like a caged opera, like an industrial operation, basically.
[00:23:26] Right. So as you can see, like this person had the intention of actually becoming healthy, you know what I mean? Listening to the dietician, she said, go buy free range. Organic chicken. He went and then maybe he found out through a show like this free range, organic chicken, isn't the way to go. Then he went to a small farmer, but you can see, it gets really tricky at the small farmer level as well.
[00:23:47] Colin Stuckert: [00:23:47] Okay. So what would people do? I mean, obviously like every single one of these things, pork beef, chicken, and then you get into plants. Like they all have problems. And again like that, humoristic of the bigger it is. The more mass produce. You shouldn't be eating it for the [00:24:00] most part. And then you have stuff that's in the middle.
[00:24:02] That what you're saying is probably duping a lot of people. Cause they think it's good and they're buying it and they think, Oh, it's fine. And, but we want to kind of move people maybe to the real. Way of sourcing, which you said you had recommendations for that. So let's focus on giving me where those recommendations are.
[00:24:17] And like, obviously we can do chicken and beef. Maybe. I don't know if you have like, by category, but maybe also just some general ways to think about all the food. Like, are there some like farmer specific ways or like getting to know your farmer and like asking how they're doing it and that's what you stick to.
[00:24:30] What's like a, just an overall sourcing methodology to solve a lot of these
[00:24:34] Eugene Trufkin: [00:24:34] problems. Yeah. So great resource for like basically pork and lamb. Goats and beef. Okay. The sources, American grassfed association, I think.org or.com. I forgot exactly what they registered as, but if you go to the bottom of the website, they have an interactive map of the U S
[00:24:54] Colin Stuckert: [00:24:54] I've seen that.
[00:24:54] So are you, are you saying that every farm that's on their website is like half it has to pass some certain mustard? Like how to, what do they. Gaging to do that. And I assume these are mostly small farmers too.
[00:25:06] Eugene Trufkin: [00:25:06] Yeah. Th they're basically all small farmers. So in terms of like grass fed labeling, there is no basically oversight on that label.
[00:25:13] So anyone can claim grassfed fed claim, whatever. It's extremely hard to actually find legitimate grassfed beef in the U S so in relation to that American grassfed association is. One of the few third-party certification bodies that actually goes out there and inspects the site before certifying [00:25:30] them, that they actually are legitimately a bidding by their practices that their average results without us.
[00:25:36] So, I mean, could it be better? They do once a year inspections plus like a random stop and inspection basically. Now that's good. Okay. I mean, could it be better? Of course it could be better, but the other alternative is no. Oh yeah. Compared to,
[00:25:48] Colin Stuckert: [00:25:48] yeah. Compared to what's going on.
[00:25:50] Eugene Trufkin: [00:25:50] Yeah. I mean, all the beef is basically like bright red with very white, fat thick.
[00:25:57] Pieces of fat on it. You know, that's not grass fed beef, although they advertise as grasps would be, first of all, the fat would never be like hard, like plaques, you know? And then it's not going to be like that abundant where it's like this much fat and like more meat. And then on top of that, it's like, it's not going to be like bright red.
[00:26:13] It's going to be more like burgundy red or like maybe even, almost like. Borderline purple. You know, if it's beef. So if you don't have the time, that's a great resource because at least there's some kind of oversight
[00:26:26] Colin Stuckert: [00:26:26] going on there and you can find some local farms is what you're saying. That probably also produce maybe pork, chicken, other things too.
[00:26:32] Yeah. They don't
[00:26:33] Eugene Trufkin: [00:26:33] even need to be local.
[00:26:34] Colin Stuckert: [00:26:34] Like actually nowadays you can just buy online. True. Yeah.
[00:26:36] Eugene Trufkin: [00:26:36] So like, I don't even have a car. I get all my food delivered to my door, through small family farms in the Texas area. For example, I don't even have a car. I haven't gone to the grocery store in like probably a year and a half.
[00:26:48] Basically how it works is like easy grass. Raised beef is a great company that has a good establishment and good logistics. I haven't had any issues with them. Great customer service as well. You order it before Tuesday, they ship it out [00:27:00] on Tuesday. You get it out Thursday, right to your doorstep for 10 bucks.
[00:27:03] And you can order a large quantity of meat too, for like three or four weeks to really optimize the $10 shipping. Some people have an issue with frozen needs, but they have to understand that it's usually flash frozen shortly after it's been slaughtered. So actually the nutritional
[00:27:18] Colin Stuckert: [00:27:18] better places do that, right?
[00:27:20] Eugene Trufkin: [00:27:20] I was actually preserved. Yeah. All right, another great website is eat wild.com. That's an amazing resource. You can go to the top left corner and it has like, I think eggs, uh, dairy poultry, once again, all small farms and most, all of them do shipping. So don't worry if they're not like 10 feet away from you, you don't have to drive people.
[00:27:41] They do ship directly to you. Uh, having said that you do have to ask some questions because
[00:27:47] Colin Stuckert: [00:27:47] I was going to say, what should people look for? When evaluating these small farms, because let's assume that based on, like, if we're trying to summarize the, because all these, these are different rabbit holes, they could all go down and like, you've obviously been super deep into this.
[00:28:00] I've, I've explored them myself to varying extent, but then I got to get to a point where I feel like I understand enough about this. So I just don't need to be getting any of this stuff from the supermarket as much as possible. And I currently do source from, from a few farms myself and I have a lot of them just ship in.
[00:28:14] But I do find myself, like for convenience, just wanting to grab a steak sometimes at HEB or whatever. And I try to find like the local stuff, but what is the kind of gold standard? Is it like, we just have to find farms that are doing the, each thing the right way, whether its [00:28:30] chicken, whether it's pork, whether it's beef and then just basically committing to like supporting them because we can kind of know that they're doing it the right way, like moving forward.
[00:28:36] Like, is that kind of. Th the best we can do. I mean, aside from raising our own food, right. Which most people aren't going to do.
[00:28:43] Eugene Trufkin: [00:28:43] Yeah. That's true. The gold standard, it varies from product to product. For beef. It would be a fair USDA, organic certified it's like a circular symbol plus. AGA certified is what does the AGA is that the American grassfed association?
[00:28:59] Okay, got it. Got it. Yeah, both of those leafy Creek farm.com is in Texas, right outside of the San Antonio area. Dare the place where I actually order a decent amount of might be from so they're USDA organic certified. Plus AGA certified. I mean, you're getting audited so much in that case, you know, there's no system in that, in that case.
[00:29:20] So it was possible to cheat that system than it would just be produced at the right way. Yeah. For a lot of people it's not realistic, but what I did was actually firstname.lastname@example.org for over a year and a half. So he sells wild cattle. Okay, wait a second.
[00:29:36] Colin Stuckert: [00:29:36] How do you spell that? A five bar beef. Is it like the number five or
[00:29:41] Eugene Trufkin: [00:29:41] the number five, five bar beef.com.
[00:29:44] He doesn't use any vaccines. Does he use any medicines? Doesn't even clip his bulls. So you get like higher testosterone
[00:29:50] Colin Stuckert: [00:29:50] content and he lets them just run in the wild basically. Kind of like, yes, they,
[00:29:55] Eugene Trufkin: [00:29:55] he does, we didn't rotate them on a fresh pasture, but outside of that, they're [00:30:00] literally not even touched.
[00:30:01] And he's basically been raising the same herd for like 30 years. So why don't you did to not have to use any vaccines or medicines? And this is a great subject in terms of what's going on today was he basically let the cattle do what they were going to do. He didn't touch them from day one, the ones that died out and couldn't survive in that environment.
[00:30:20] They just died out the ones that survived. They have kids that are able to flourish in that environment to do the same exact thing. And now he doesn't have to literally use any medicines. No vaccines. Yeah. As nature intended, 2% grass fed with supplemented with alfalfa maybe last week or so they're processed.
[00:30:41] Uh, so if you want like wild domesticated animals, that's like pretty much as close to wild wheat outside of like elk and venison and all that other stuff, you know? Yeah. That's awesome. I buy my stuff from him as well, and that's not realistic for most people obviously to volunteer, although that would be the.
[00:30:57] Best solution, because then it's up to you, you know, are these guys meeting your standards? You're there every other day. You can see what they're doing. Right? You're happy with it. Some questions to ask in terms of poultry. Like if I were to go to a small farmer, I would ask them, well, how many square feet do you have per hand?
[00:31:13] And you can kind of eyeball this too. You don't really need to ask them. But a good base. Mark is you want like around 200 square feet per hand. Usually if they're getting tighter, like a hundred, two 50, or like that free range is 1.5, come on. That's like embarrassing. You know, it's like a shoe box.
[00:31:30] [00:31:29] Basically. If the square footage per head is getting smaller and smaller, that means each head has less access to the bugs and worms and all those other minerals, the grass, et cetera in the ground. So that means, uh, to support those numbers, they have to bring in a lot of grain. Yep. So then the next question would be, what kind of grain are you using?
[00:31:48] They'll say, Oh, non-GMO grain. Okay. Well, is it organic? Like, is it USDA organic certified, which means non GMO also. And they'll go like nine or 10 times. Oh no, it's not, you know, or those subtypes say like, Oh, it's seasonal. So sometimes they do have it. Sometimes they don't. Then that's up to you to decide what you think about, you know, the other question will be like, Oh, you know, how often do you rotate them onto your fresh pasture?
[00:32:11] Or do you even rotate them at all? You ideally want to rotate daily because once again, these animals really deplete the ground, extremely
[00:32:18] Colin Stuckert: [00:32:18] space rotation. Are there some hens don't eat any grains? Is that a, is that a thing? Oh, actually one thing I do, we have asked there's some eggs here that we skipped from farmhouse delivery that we could tell the difference between the hens that were eating corn and soy.
[00:32:31] For, I think it was even just corn, cause it was soy free, but they were still eating corn and Alison and myself could both feel a difference when we found some eggs that I guess it was a different farm, no corn, no soy. Um, I guess he might have done grains, but probably the other grains that just weren't the corn, corn and soy.
[00:32:45] So that's something that I think people should try it out.
[00:32:47] Eugene Trufkin: [00:32:47] Yeah. Uh, you know, at the end of the call, I might ask you, I might actually ask what you find out in Texas. I got to find out
[00:32:52] Colin Stuckert: [00:32:52] again, like, cause we haven't had them in a while and I do miss them. They, I could notice a difference in my gut cause eggs disrupt me generally.
[00:32:59] And I could eat those [00:33:00] eggs and I would have no problem
[00:33:01] Eugene Trufkin: [00:33:01] whatsoever. No, I'm the same way. Like for some reason eating poultry, that's heavily fed grains. It kind of messes up my stomach
[00:33:07] Colin Stuckert: [00:33:07] because that to me too, like if I eat like a pork roast has too much fat in it, I just feel sick. Something transfers it.
[00:33:13] Maybe with the fat of the mega sticks, I don't know. Or maybe the grains they were fed, but I think it transfers into, you know, an animal like pork has a lot of fat. So you get a lot of those pesticides or, or the things they're eating or whatever into that, and then you're consuming it. You know, I don't, I just feel like pork really hits me hard too.
[00:33:28] Eugene Trufkin: [00:33:28] So yeah, for me, like I email@example.com. They're like the only place I know that's corn and soy and USDA organic certified. It actually rotates their hands onto fresh pasture. Like every single day. And the square foot per hand is like 240
[00:33:44] Colin Stuckert: [00:33:44] there. So that sounds like the gold standard for chicken.
[00:33:46] Eugene Trufkin: [00:33:46] Yeah. That would be, that would be the gold standard, which is, you're not going to find the supermarket. No. Right, right. The best is you'll find like vital farms, which is still a good bet. It's still a huge upgrade from the other eggs, but there's this, like, you'll see it on the back of the label. It has 100 this logo that says 100 in big bold letters.
[00:34:02] That means 100 square foot per space. Oh,
[00:34:06] Colin Stuckert: [00:34:06] yeah, that show does that show up on most egg cartons? I don't know if I would notice that it's fairly rare
[00:34:12] Eugene Trufkin: [00:34:12] just for them. I see. Vital farms has, it's a certification it's like certified before that
[00:34:18] Colin Stuckert: [00:34:18] like a certification for an amount of space. That's actually not ideal.
[00:34:23] Right. That shouldn't show you exactly how the food industry is set
[00:34:25] Eugene Trufkin: [00:34:25] up. I mean, compared to 1.5 square foot. Right,
[00:34:29] Colin Stuckert: [00:34:29] right. Yeah. [00:34:30] So they're comparing it to like the mass producer trying to appeal that market. Yeah. Yeah. Okay. Well, so are there any kind of final like tips tricks or whatever, because I think we've got a good idea for, for people.
[00:34:41] Like I've been telling people for awhile, find some farms that, you know, like, and trust, you know, if you want to get to know the farmers, that's great. Or you just ask a few questions and just kind of trust. They're going to do it from here on out. Right. And then support them. And as long as the quality is consistent and you don't have any adverse reactions or whatever, I, for the most part buy from the same places, it sounds like you do that as well.
[00:35:00] And in the sea of. Fraud that's out there. It was a lot of it is actual fraud and some of it is just mislabeling or whatever. It's like, you kind of want to keep it simple with this stuff. And think of the grocery store is like an emergency situation. Almost like, like if you, if you have no food or whatever, like go sure.
[00:35:16] Go to the grocery store. Right. But are there any final tips of how, about, about how people can think about this or, or maybe they questions asked or things to do.
[00:35:23] Eugene Trufkin: [00:35:23] Yeah. They're so honestly, I hate to make this one quick because it is important. A lot of people will bring up the fact it's just too expensive.
[00:35:32] That's why I unpack that real quick. I shop a shop. That's why I buy the cheap stuff. So from my research, uh, we can talk small scale, large scale, basically in short, a factory farm 2000 calorie diet. A day diet is basically $7 and 77 cents. Okay,
[00:35:49] Colin Stuckert: [00:35:49] wait a day. That's what you're saying. Okay.
[00:35:52] Eugene Trufkin: [00:35:52] Okay. Go ahead. 7 cents.
[00:35:54] And then USDA organic certified diet, 2000 calories mashed for the same micronutrients, [00:36:00] macronutrients, whatever $12 and 12 cents a day. So it's a $5 difference, but that $5 difference basically comes from all these subsidies that are going on. The industrial agricultural system is heavily subsidized because grain is subsidized.
[00:36:16] Plus if the farmer goes out of business, Who pays off that loan. The taxpayer pays off that loan. Now the taxpayer is paying that as well. So they're actually, it's kind of they're prepaying for me. You're going to the grocery store. You're seeing ground beef, a dollar or a pound of ground beef for like four bucks because you prepaid two to $3.
[00:36:35] You're really paying seven bucks. So it doesn't look like you're paying, but you're. And what about health?
[00:36:40] Colin Stuckert: [00:36:40] What about the health consequences of standard American diet and the lost work to us productivity? The healthcare costs, like, I mean, it's unbelievable real food this way. And I think direct from farmer and you save time, it's simple.
[00:36:52] You can stay consistent with it. Like the amount of time people spend in grocery stores is actually kind of ridiculous. Like you go there for like an hour, a fair minimum, you know, like it's like if you factor in all those things and then you feel better and that has downstream effects to like your life and.
[00:37:05] Like getting a promotion and just getting like, there's so many examples to which it's not even close of a comparison. Like, I actually think that. You will lose way more money in the standard American diet on just a dollar per dollar basis. It might take like five years for that to like etched out or whatever.
[00:37:19] But I don't believe that cheap food is saving anybody. Any money. If you look back on everything. Yeah.
[00:37:26] Eugene Trufkin: [00:37:26] Well, the average American is spending according to Paul Chek by five to [00:37:30] $7,000 a year on medical expenses. So if you factor that in dude, it's like a no it's insane. The average American is spending seven to 14,000 a year on non-essential expenses.
[00:37:40] Which include alcohol, uh, cell phone. Right. They definitely don't need Netflix subscriptions, other random BS. That's really not adding literally any value to your life. Yeah. So once you factor all that in, I mean, it's like, dude, a no brainer, what decision you should be making, you know? Yeah. Couldn't agree more.
[00:37:59] There was a training. It's not just in that topic.
[00:38:01] Colin Stuckert: [00:38:01] Yeah. Yeah. Obviously. Yeah. That's a big topic, you know, maybe we can default show just on the expensive food and all that, but I appreciate you coming on. And obviously like there's a lot of different rabbit holes here. Where could people, do you have like a hub of where you're, you're documenting this or is this just more something you're trying to get awareness
[00:38:16] Eugene Trufkin: [00:38:16] out?
[00:38:17] I just, I have the book, you know, the anti factory farm shopping guide book. That has a huge,
[00:38:22] Colin Stuckert: [00:38:22] okay. Yeah. So we'll have a link to that. So it's auntie, so the anti factory farm shopping guide. Oh, well, that's awesome. So, so that sounds like an easy reference. Yeah, we talked about, so, okay. So there'll be links to that below.
[00:38:37] And are you on social media, anything like that where people can follow along or. Yeah,
[00:38:40] Eugene Trufkin: [00:38:40] can just Google my name and find a bunch of Instagram and Facebook and YouTube and all that.
[00:38:46] Colin Stuckert: [00:38:46] Okay. Awesome. Great, great. Okay. Well, this is obviously, you know, for time's sake, there's a lot of different things to explore here, but I think if we were to sum it up, you know, you really get to know your farmer, which is kind of something people hear, but I mean, Do it though, like [00:39:00] actually do it.
[00:39:00] And it's amazing. You could even with some of these farms set up auto ship on a monthly basis, I don't even have to check out for this one from my buy from, they just send me, it's like 150 bucks and they send me like a mixed, like, there's like a couple of rib-eyes it's like this it's like that. And I just, it shows up and I eat it and it's awesome.
[00:39:14] And it's like, I'd have to buy that or think about, or do anything. So I just think we need to do that more. And we need to, we really do need to support the small farmers that are doing the right way. Like sh sh use market forces to change food system because the food system is not going to change until there are actual dollars at play that to do it, you know?
[00:39:30] So thanks for coming on the show you gene. Appreciate it.
[00:39:36] Eugene Trufkin: [00:39:36] Wow, please. I always remember that the members of the ancestral mind podcast are not in fact medical professionals. They're not doctors, they're not nutritionists. They are simply providing this entertainment for you to do your own research and. To entertain yourselves. So please consult a physician before changing your diet.
[00:40:00] Not everything works for everybody and make sure you always do your own research on everything you hear on this show and outside.