Are Eye Glasses A Billion Dollar Scam? With Jake Steiner

#104 - Are Eye Glasses A Billion Dollar Scam? With Jake Steiner

Joining us today is Jake Steiner of, here to give us valuable info about the common condition and how it might not be as much of a life sentence as we think! Hear all about how Jake naturally beat his severe myopia and how he's helping others do the same. Tune in now!

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[00:00:00] In the beginning. When you go tothe optometrist, the correct diagnosis would be go outside more, spend, lesstime in front of books, keep more distance from screens and you'll be fine, butthey don't do that. They say your glasses because that's what they're trainedto do. They're not lying to you.

[00:00:12] They're not trying to misleadyou. That's just what they are. Oh.

[00:00:30] welcome to the show. JakeSteiner. Thank you for being here. Calling of course is here, but we're moreinterested in learning a little bit about you. Tell us who you are. The quickversion and then we'll get into this cause Colin is chomping at the bit. That'syeah. Well, thanks for having me on. I totally appreciate it.

[00:00:48] So my name is Jake Steiner. Um,I'm, uh, I'm all kinds of things. I'm mainly an investor in stock trader. Andthen, uh, about 20 years ago, I kind of stumbled into this topic of eyesight[00:01:00] utopia short-sightedness I used to wear. Very strong glasses and itgot to the point. I was actually in Bangkok at the time.

[00:01:07] I couldn't see the little taxisigns at night. And then I went to Nepal mattress. They told me I need strongerglasses that were super thick already. I was, my eyes looked really tiny behindthe lenses, right? Like the strong your glasses are the smaller everythingbehind them. And I was just sick of it.

[00:01:22] And I asked them what was upwith that? And they said, it's a. Genetic condition and there's nothing anybodycould do. And, uh, that was kind of before internet for the most part. And Istarted doing research in libraries and I've found that shortsighted isshortsightedness is not a genetic condition.

[00:01:37] There's a whole lot ofscientific evidence, what actually causes it. And I managed to reverse it. Likeright now, listeners are not seeing the video, but I'm not wearing glasses. Idon't need glasses. I've 20, 20 eyesight. Uh, I've started a site called And now that's a pretty big global community of tons of people whoare doing the same thing, getting rid of their glass.

[00:01:57] But how do you spell that? Whatis the website and [00:02:00] Milia and E N D M Y O P I and listeners, ifyou're interested, that's in the show notes, you can click it. Yeah. That'ssuper fascinating. So you tell me where we should go with the first intro tothis. Cause like, then I'm going to let my questions come out when I interruptyou at, from time to time.

[00:02:16] My first favorite point of allthis stuff is. Do you research before you get into any weirdness that peopletalk about on the internet, especially when it comes to health stuff,especially when it comes to stuff. People call prescriptions my favoritewebsite, scholar dot, It's all the clinical research that Googlecatalog.

[00:02:38] So you're not looking at regularGoogle. You're not looking at weird internet stuff. Yeah. You'll see articlesthat show up. Yep. Yeah. Peer reviewed clinical science. So everything that Italk about, you can find on Google scholar and it's, and I highly recommenddoing that instead of trusting me. We just kind of talked before the show abouttitles.

[00:02:57] Yeah. I don't have a title. Idon't want a [00:03:00] title. And I'm trying to get people to start thinkingin terms of do a little bit of research, as opposed to just trusting a personbecause of the title. Yeah. Yeah. So, okay. That's the disclaimer, do yourresearch now, you started with what sounded like a pretty severe eyesight issuewhere you had these like mega bifocals or maybe they'll call it something elsewhere you I'm envisioning the character from office space.

[00:03:22] Is that, is that accurate?Didn't he have like the big thick glasses and he's walking around

[00:03:29] strong enough. Okay. They werestrong enough that if I take them off and I put them somewhere, I'd never findthem again without classes, because I kind of see where they are. Could not, noway, no way. I couldn't see anything without glasses. So I was, yeah, I waspretty blind. What age did that start? Was this like through trial Hunter?

[00:03:48] Just out of nowhere, one day.You're like, bam, can't see. Teenage years, uh, pretty average, couldn't readthe board and school perfectly. And parents took me to the optometrist, gotclasses. Okay. Tell me [00:04:00] some of the lies and some of themisconceptions and some of the, you know, how maybe the incentive structure andthe actual profits that can be made, you know, how has that warped the public'sperception of eyesight?

[00:04:10] Like where do you, wherever thebest point to start that you think? So. When I first went to the optometrist.Right. But it was a teenager. Now it's kids that are even younger. You go tothe optometrist, you get classes and. What they don't tell you is thatinitially your eyes are fine. That that sense that you can't see super clearly,far away is something called pseudo myopia.

[00:04:32] If you go to Google scholar andyou type in pseudo myopia, you'll find like 50,000 clinical science references.And that is there's a muscle in your eye that controls focus. And that muscleis tight. When you look at something up close, And it's relaxed when you lookat something in the distance and when you spend too much time looking atsomething up close, like books or screens, that muscle spasms.

[00:04:55] So another term for that is nearinduced transient. MUPIA also very [00:05:00] popular on Google scholar. In thebeginning. When you go to the optometrist, the correct diagnosis would be gooutside more, spend, less time in front of books, keep more distance fromscreens and you'll be fine, but they didn't do that.

[00:05:11] They say your glasses. Causethat's what they're trained to do. They're not lying to you. They're not tryingto mislead you. That's just what they're taught. Yep. Another little tiny,interesting point is the wholesale cost of a pair of lenses is anywhere fromtwo to $5. So when you pay a hundred bucks for glasses or 200 or 300 to 500,the profit margins are extreme.

[00:05:33] Yeah, massive. And I'm also astock trader and I have a fair amount of stuff in that industry just from yearsago. And it's done extremely well because that's, you know, that's and that'snot going anywhere. Right. Right now in Hong Kong and China, and a lot of Asiancountries, the incidence rate of myopia of short-sightedness in aged childrenis over 90%.

[00:05:54] So basically everybody's acustomer. Yeah. I mean, you're growing up reading books, looking at screens,playing [00:06:00] games, like up close and you know, that's. So before werecording, I mentioned how I felt like my eyesight has gotten worse. Uh, and itreally felt like it peaked maybe a couple of years ago. And then when I wasdriving back to Florida from Texas at night, I noticed.

[00:06:16] Like the lights and the signsand things like I had to squint and do things like that. And I never in my lifehad to do that. So that obviously made me concerned. I've just put off evengoing to consult with her. She had glasses or not, because I just don't want todo it. Right. But I feel like since I've actually moved out to the country andI've incorporated more going outside, I've incorporated probably less netoverall screen exposure.

[00:06:36] I feel like mine has gottenbetter, but I haven't really recognized it. But now that I think about it, itseems like it's gotten better, especially my night vision when I'm driving. Soyou're saying that there could be some correlation to maybe lifestyle and whatI'm doing and that maybe the muscles relaxing or something very likely you canprint an eye chart by the way, it can buy one on Amazon or whatever, and justhang it up somewhere.

[00:06:54] So you can actually compare,because for example, if you spend four hours, bingeing, Netflix on an[00:07:00] iPad at like 40 centimeters from you at like barely arms length andyou check that I tried before and after you're going to notice. Notably yourvision is going to be worse after that, just because that muscle spasms, so avery temporary, and it very much depends on your habits, right?

[00:07:17] So even if you got a new phoneor you got a new subscription to a thing, and now you're sitting closer to it,or you're spending more time in a dark room in front of a screen, anything thatmakes that muscle tense for longer periods of time gives you a little bit of aspasm. So you can't see clearly, far away.

[00:07:34] So are we talking aboutsomething that like, if you just change the habit and give it a few weeks? Youcan return to a baseline. What about people that have been just doing this foryears? Do they need like literally a year of habit change? Like what I mean,and again, I don't know. Where do we find the information?

[00:07:48] Is there a research that talksabout this or is this just kind of like things you've been figuring out on yourown? The research exists for everything that causes me Copia for how to reverseit. That's kind of my thing, but yeah, so, you know, [00:08:00] half thestories out there and it's just enough to get people started in when you go tothe optometrist and they tell you it's genetic and you just go.

[00:08:08] I trust this guy or this guywent to school versus me, random dude on the internet. That's why we say Googlescholars, your friend, pseudo myopia. And then what happens if you go to the optometrist,they will sell your glasses. And the problem that happens with glasses, glassescause more myopia. There's something called hyperopic defocus that you can findon Google scholar.

[00:08:29] When you put on glasses, theypush the light back further in your eye, and there's a mechanism in your eyethat continually adjust the length of it throughout your whole life. And itcauses the eye to elongate. And elongated eye is a more short-sighted eyes. Soif you went to the optometrist shine now, and you've got minus one doctorglasses a year from now, those would again, feel a little bit too weak, andthat's how they get you, right?

[00:08:51] Because then you go back again.I'm getting angry as well. When we were just talking about my girlfriend beforethe show started and she just [00:09:00] bought glasses at Warby Parker, liketwo days ago, her prescription, she has been getting worse and worse. And nowI'm sitting here thinking. Maybe I just need to make her not play candy crush.

[00:09:09] Yeah. But also you guys probablydon't do outside enough going to go in the sunlight. Like there's a lot ofthings you could probably do it from a lifestyle perspective that could helpwith that. I feel like going outside is a big one, so, okay. Before we get intolike some of the remedies people can do, let me, let me just try to bottle upmy anger by being now red pilled with the eye industry.

[00:09:26] Because again, I got one morething out of the red pill about, because we just had a whole discussion aboutgetting red pill for all the crap going on. Now I got to worry about anotherindustry. So for me, it's. The food industry, pharmaceutical industries,medical, sick care, all these things are basically big accidental conspiraciesthat there's a profit motive.

[00:09:41] There's lobbying. There's,there's just a lot of nonsense. And I wouldn't try, I don't trust any doctors,but anything be honest. Right. That's just kinda my personal thing. So. I don'teven know if had a question there. Maybe I'm just ranting to get it out, butthis just really pisses me off so much. So it's like, it's so that's when thiswhole thing started out.

[00:10:00] [00:09:59] If you go back andmyopia has got like 1200 or so individual articles, all of which I wrote, ifyou go back far enough, there were just rants because I used to be super angrybecause when I started improving my sight, I was excited and I would go tooptometrists and be like, check this out. Yeah. The negative attitudes werejust shocked.

[00:10:20] He just write you off. It's justlike doctors that you saw, you lose weight, for example, and you're saying, Oh,I'm eating a carnival diet or I'm eating a lot of meat. And I'm like, high-fatand they're just like, no, that can't be your you're you're an anomaly go awaybasically. Right. It's the same. It's literally the same thing.

[00:10:35] It's like when people reallyunderstand how so much of our world is built on backward incentive structuresand how science itself doesn't even get utilized. Enough in certain areas andpolicy, whatever, man, it's just so frustrating. So it sounds like now, isthere a case where anybody needs glasses? Is there, is there like a medicalreason for why some people might need it where it's not reversible or you not,maybe even sure enough yet to make that assertion.

[00:10:59] Cause it sounds like it's true.The [00:11:00] scam at this point, of course, there are, there are cases thatare absolutely are cases, but they're rare. They're exceedingly rare, rare,more little points. When you're talking about lobbying glasses are clear curvedpieces of plastic, right? I mean, they're literally, you can't hurt yourselfwith clear lenses.

[00:11:20] They were never prescriptionsuntil the lens industry spent millions lobbying. To make them prescriptions. Soyou could only buy them from optometrist. So they had to raise the price. Yeah,because you can buy reading glasses for 10 bucks. Right. And reading glassesare plus lenses and distance, vision glasses, or minus like, they're the samething.

[00:11:40] So when you see Penn dollarreading glasses, It's the same thing as distance glasses that you pay a hundredbucks and Warby Parker for, but because they made them prescriptions right now,you don't ask questions because they call you a patient and they call themprescriptions. And then when it's $200, it's $200, but it's just clear[00:12:00] curved pieces of plastic.

[00:12:01] I had never considered. Why arethey prescriptions? That just my whole life you've, you've gotten prescriptionsfor glasses. I've never needed them, but that's what you do. You get yourprescription. And then I'm thinking, well, other things that you needprescriptions for, you need, yeah. There can be dangerous to giving somebodyAdderall who doesn't, you know, doesn't need or shouldn't have it.

[00:12:20] It's got an amphetamine in it,like a lot of bad things that can happen from giving that kind of prescription.So it should be controlled, but yeah. What are, are we worried about peopleswallowing contact lenses? Like that's impressive that they were able to getthat control. Tylenol is way more dangerous than clear.

[00:12:37] I was about to say somethinglike that layout, like a lot of the prescription drugs are just okay. Um, feelfree to treat questions in their symptom treatment is the default. Right. Andit's an, okay. So the thing to make you feel a little bit better about this iswhen I tell people most people don't care.

[00:12:58] So it's not really just the[00:13:00] optometrist. Most people love the quick fix implicit in it, justlike the pharmaceutical industry. People want a pill to solve the problems.They don't wanna hear it eat. Right. Exercise, do whatever. Right. Becausethat's hard. So what are treatments? Like? What does that look like?

[00:13:13] Is it like you got trainingprograms, you, you have to go outside and do certain things, because again,these are hard things. So it doesn't surprise me that a lot of people, maybethey don't want to hear the truth. Yeah. Well, because the truth is you'readdicted to your phone. And you're specifically, you need healthy habits.

[00:13:29] And so what would that, I mean,your website, do people come to you or they're in, like they get access to liketraining? Do you like coach people through it? What, give me an idea of likewhat this looks like. Like if I'm saying, okay, I want to, even now I want tostart the, my site. I already feel like I want to do it.

[00:13:43] So I'm going to be doingwhatever you tell me to do at this point. I'm gonna be, I'm going to be doingthis stuff. So what would you do with someone that's like, Oh, I'm the verge.I'm going to get glasses, but I'm not sure, whatever, what can I do to maybe tosee if I can improve it on my own? There's a little tiny bit of a learningcurve, because what I found [00:14:00] in the past with trust, trying to givepeople the steps, they always miss the understanding of what's going on withthe biology.

[00:14:07] Right? So there's a little tinybit of, uh, having to understand, like the thing that makes your eyesightbetter is challenging it a little tiny bit to two pieces. Actually one isreduced the strain. So the distance that you hold your phone from your face, Isreally bad because the closer you get the tighter that that muscle is in youreye.

[00:14:27] So further ways better, thefurther it is, the more relaxed that muscle gets, the closer you get, the morethat muscle has to tighten up to give you focus. So could you overdue like longdistance? Like if, if I was watching TV with big texts, like 20 feet away and Imade that my default, that's not likely to cause an imbalance just the way.

[00:14:45] Short-sighted what, on the otherside. Distance is fine. It's just close up is a problem. And the closer youget, the more you cause that spasm and there's something even at appears tohappen, that when you keep taking the phone out and you keep taking your phoneout, you do it over and [00:15:00] over again. The most, it gets stuck in thatposition.

[00:15:02] So even if you just go from, I'mgoing to stop using my phone for browsing, and I'm going to switch to a laptopthat is at a. At twice the distance, right? So you already reduced that strainby a lot, right? Even just like, because I get what people are saying. And oneof my, my main approach is I don't want you to change, have to change yourwhole life to make this work.

[00:15:26] Right. So it's little habitchanges. It's just, okay. The phone is not a good distance. Anything that'sthis close the less, the better, right? The more distance distance, the betteroff you are. And then the second part is you. You know how to do this? Causeyou said at night you're squinting and doing stuff to clear things up,challenging your eyes.

[00:15:46] Like if you're going to a coffeeshop and there's a menu behind the barista, and it's kind of hard to read, juststaring at that thing for a little while and trying to clear up all the textand read all the texts like that little bit of [00:16:00] challenge. If youbuild it into habit, continuously improves your eyesight.

[00:16:04] And there are super, super shortversion of reversing. MLPs is freaking simple is like I was a minus five,right. They go in a quarter diopter increment. So it goes 0.25 0.5 0.751. Andit goes up like that. And basically from my minus five, I would just go down aquarter step, right? Like the smallest possible change.

[00:16:27] And then everything in adistance is a tiny, little bit more blurry. And then a challenge. My site justregularly and after two or three months, everything's perfectly clear. And thenI go down another quarter, step, you take your prescription and you drop itdown East time, like less, less strong. Oh, okay.

[00:16:45] Yep. Let's call it asubscription. So we don't play into this right subscription. Yeah, exactly. So,okay. These things are making sense now. What else though? Like, are thereother tips? Do people need to have like some, they have to buy a [00:17:00]program? Like what, what are we looking at here? And it's, it's a bit of arabbit hole because once you get started for every question you have, for everyanswer, you get, you have two more questions.

[00:17:10] That's why the site's huge. Andwe have a big Facebook group and we have a big forum. We have just generally alarge community. I have a bunch of videos for troubleshooting and stuff. I'mgiving you a super short starting point of reduces strain, avoid the up andchallenge your eyes for distance. Like when you go friend, Went to theoptometrist.

[00:17:29] If she just got like a minus oneor something like that, not wearing those. And instead challenging her eyeswould fix the problem. It might take six months. It might take a year, butshe's fine right now. That's just giving her a lot of extra clarity that youget addicted to in a way, like, it's really hard to take those things back offbecause now she's like, wow, it's too blurry.

[00:17:51] Yep. Right now I get to see theworld in HD. So why would I go back to standard definition and try to. Do HDpushups. [00:18:00] Yeah, I get that. It's really it's that simple becauseevery time she's going to go back to the optometrist, they're going to bump hersubscription up by another quarter. Step. Right, but that's another sale.

[00:18:12] She's going to buy new frames.She's going to buy new lenses. They're going to make 6000% markup on thatstuff. And then she's happy. Cause she's like, wow, things are extra, superclear again. And the next year she's going to come back and it's going to beanother quarter step up. And what I'm saying is you can bump it down the samequarter steps every three to four months on average works for most people.

[00:18:34] So you basically just reversingthe story. It's not really any more complicated than that. Do you have a bunchof success stories, like people that have talked about this or clients you'veworked with? Or what does that look like as a zillion Zillow? Yeah, I've beenplaying with this for the last 20 years.

[00:18:51] I've been fairly serious aboutit for the last 10. Um, for example, our Facebook group has 17,000 some oddmembers [00:19:00] that give progress reports all the time. Uh, copy paste someout of emails. We have thousands on the website, literally thousands. And Irecently finally started like a podcast style thing where we talk aboutprogress updates.

[00:19:13] And I just started it recently.Right now there's like 20 or 30 episodes are sewing there, but I've got 500more I can do because if you commit to it and you care and you want to improveyour eyesight, you will. There's no, nobody fails at it or very rarely. Haveyou had any people that have struggled?

[00:19:32] Like what are some of thesticking points where somebody like, if somebody says, okay, I want to get offhis glasses. Um, I took it down two of my subscription notches or whatever. Imean, they stuck on this last one, right? What are there certain techniques orinterventions? They just have to give them more time.

[00:19:47] I have a whole troubleshootingplaylist just because there's so many things that I've found over the yearsthat people misjudge most commonly probably is people. Aren't improving andthey think they don't [00:20:00] have as much speed time as I do. It's likeaddict who doesn't recognize this problem. And I'm like, okay, it's time youspend on your screen.

[00:20:07] And they're like on hour or two.And I'm like, all right, screenshot your, your screen time. Right. And thenit's like seven and a half hours average per day. That's why you're notimproving. Like as long as you keep reintroducing that spasm, that spasm givesyou more blur. And as long as that muscle is stuck, you can't work on yourdistance focus.

[00:20:27] You got to get that muscle andstuck first, the muscles relaxed, and then you can work on your distancevision. How does light play a role? I was just, that's my blue light and bluelight. Like, so if I'm in this room right now, it's kind of grainy. Cause mylight's kind of low at night. I like to work in a low light, but let's assumeI'm, you know, um, what, I'm a foot and a half from my screen.

[00:20:45] I got my big iMac. I can stepback even a little bit. Do I need more light, less light there's orange, light,blue light, certain bulbs, more lights, better to post better. Yeah. To a pointobviously again here, where you can [00:21:00] do is I chart and you cancompare, for example, in shaded outdoor light and indoors, where yet you willsee a difference in your acuity.

[00:21:08] How clearly you can see how faraway and with that you can judge, even like, for example, if you look at textson your screen, if it gets blurry at all, At any distance, right? If you up thelights and you, now you can see it better. You can tell that amount of morelight would be helpful. Low light generally is not super great.

[00:21:28] He gets a little more involved.The rods and cones in which are activated and low light versus also your eyesuse contrast detection for focus. So that gets less active in low-light yourpupils get wide open, right? To all these things play a role in. Any refractiveerror that you have is going to be more noticeable, lower light, also strainsyour eyes more.

[00:21:49] Right. So right. Like shadedoutdoor light is like, Oh man, I forget like 1200 Lux or so average indoorlight might be like three, 300. Anything less than that, [00:22:00] you know,you notice it because if you turn no, no more light and you can see moreclearly or like, okay, that amount would be better blue light. Okay.

[00:22:08] I'm no expert on blue light.Right. Because I just deal with. Reversing short-sightedness. Yeah, myuneducated opinion on these blue light blocking glasses and all this stuff isCoke. Zero, right? Sugar is bad. We fixed the Coke. There's no sugar in it. Theproblem is the Coke. The problem isn't the sugar with the screens are theproblem.

[00:22:30] It's not the blue light part ofthe screen. Right. It's like saying low fat yogurt or whatever the thing iswhere they're just like, okay, we're going to remove the problematic thing foryou, right? Like you need less screen time. Yes. The blue light's not great. Doyou need a blue light blocking glasses? My personal unfounded opinion is.

[00:22:51] You should step away from thatscreen a couple hours before you go to bed, right? Drink water instead of Coke,zero and [00:23:00] blue light glasses, just make people feel better abouttheir addiction to screens and they buy the thing to spend a bunch of extramoney. It's just a bunch of marketing. A lot of those don't even have bluelight blocking in them.

[00:23:11] You can change the blue lightlevel just from your screen settings. Yep. That's the whole blue light lensesthing is kind of silly. What about the, some of those bullets lenses are alsomarketed as eye strain relief. Is that just like a, a very, a milder form ofglasses basically? Cause they're my understanding is they're just glasses thatlike might magnify a little bit or something or they're like, or actually Idon't even know what they do to be honest.

[00:23:38] It's most of it goes back to.Those lenses cost two bucks and then need to find a way to sell it to your 50.Right. So I strain reducing blah, blah, blah. It means nothing. The only thingthat means something is the diopter number on the lenses. Right? What is that?That's the power. The glasses. Yeah. So how much [00:24:00] smaller or biggerthings get when you look through the lenses?

[00:24:02] That's it? Everything else isjust marketing talk and a way, because these guys are really, these lenses areall made in China. They cost nothing, not all of them, but. Pretty much. It'ssuper simple to make. So now the company is sitting there going, how do wecreate a story around this that make these things worth 50 bucks, a hundredbucks or more?

[00:24:21] Yup. Right. Where did the basecost is now? Yep. I'm feeling pretty proud of myself right now at the WarbyParker store. We had decided on the glasses, JJ, like they look good orwhatever. So she got them and they asked, Oh, you want the blue light filters?And it was kind of like, they're upset. And I'm like, yeah, I don't think, no,I don't think that I need blue.

[00:24:38] Like we have a phone, it was anextra, a hundred dollars. So I said, no, right there makes you cringe. Doesn'tit take? Yeah, because, because I have the wholesale price sheets. For mostmanufacturers that the optometrist pays. Those are the prices that have lenscoatings, like [00:25:00] anti-reflective coating anti scratch, coding.

[00:25:02] All those things are like 10cents, 15 cents, 20 cents. It's nothing a hundred bucks. That's just, it's justcompletely pure profit. You know, it's just wanting the bank. It's just makingme lose faith in humanity at this point. I mean, cause you're right. It is, itis the customer that, that is paying for these products.

[00:25:20] But I mean, there is a lot ofmarketing around it and I think part of the problem with the, the prescriptionsubscription, whatever you call it, I've been thinking about this a lot lately.Why does, why do like we're in America? Of course. Are you a us citizen? Areyou from somewhere else? I'm from Germany.

[00:25:34] Oh, very cool. My family isGerman heritage. So the billions of marketing and lobbying dollars that I'vespent to prop up. Doctors as like this Bastiaan of science and expertness inour culture is unbelievable. Even though heart disease kills more people everyyear, then we have cancer. Then we have this medical errors, like 350,000.

[00:25:54] Like it's all the same. It's allthe same stuff, man. This is literally just profit driven, uh, motive with,[00:26:00] I would say, like in our culture and it's really most industrialcultures at this point, you have. Lazy people that want an easy fix. I think Ican just by there by comfort or by a fixed or whatever, I'm seeing it more andmore now in the eyesight industry.

[00:26:14] So just a new checkbox of thesame thing is happening. Yeah, it is. And there's so much weird stuff becauseyou were talking about heart disease. I was on a podcast. I have a comments.Um, I've just talked about him earlier. Yeah. I was on his podcast and heenlightened me about coronary artery calcification that I knew nothing about.

[00:26:35] My parents were both doctors. Mydad was like, you gotta be on Statens because you have high cholesterol. I did.I did some research that makes sense. I never, nobody has ever mentioned thisthing to me and actually found a hospital that does that scan to check. Right?Like if the arteries in my heart are getting calcified, so will I get heartdisease or not?

[00:26:55] My school was zero, so it wasperfect, but listening to Ivor and that whole [00:27:00] topic like that is thenumber one killer. And. They don't even test for it correctly. They don't talkabout it. They don't test for it correctly. They give you some drug that thecompanies push on you and the doctors get kickbacks.

[00:27:12] And it's literally multi-billiondollar industry standards. Like it's just unbelievable. These, I call themaccidental conspiracies. At this point, I feel like the eyesight industry ismaybe a blatant conspiracy or just. I mean, I'd have to look more into thehistory of it. I mean, it's just insane. The thing is all of those, the, thefascinating thing to me as a silly person is all the designs I quote on thewebsite and all this stuff.

[00:27:34] You find the journals wherethese things are published, peer reviewed and published all optometry andophthalmology journals. So these are the publications by and for optometristsand ophthalmologists. These people should know this. It's like what boggles mymind is. I'm literally quoting, like, if you're in car sales, I'm quoting a carmagazine and you never heard of, you know, [00:28:00] I'm like, okay.

[00:28:00] So Nina do is transit. Myopia ishow all shortsightedness starts or almost all. Short-sightedness go to 10optometrists and ask them about it. They're all going to be like you're buyingglasses or what. Yeah. Unbelievable. No, like conspiracy seems to give them toomuch credit. Yes, exactly. Yeah. Well, that's, that's why I call themaccidental because they're not nobody thought this out.

[00:28:22] It just it's like market forces,it's profit motive. It's, you know, cheap manufacturing, you know, are, youknow, being on sourcing from China, like all these things converged to justcreate this, like this behemoth. Right. But, so actually that's a good pointthough. Optometrists. And what was the other one?

[00:28:37] What were they called? Orthoophthalmologists. So do they handle like medical issues? Aren't just aboutbuying glasses. Like, do they have other things they do as doctors? Or is itjust so small that it seems like they kind of shifted their entire industryinto like basically selling eyeglasses. People are going to get pissed at mefor this one.

[00:28:55] So I'll promise you this claim.They don't just sell glasses, but they also [00:29:00] check for eyeconditions. I always tell people if you have, if you want to, I check up, go toan ophthalmologist. That's an actual doctor, right? It's a profession thatrequires a lot more schooling. It's a whole different ball game, even thoughthey both deal with eyes, your Palm interests has some amount of latitude.

[00:29:18] It depends on the area. And itdepends on like in the U S is different than in Germany, but by and large andoptometrists can, yes, they can check your eyes health, but in a very basicmanner. And I always say, if you walk into a place and the first thing you seeis a bazillion fashion brand frames, and you're in a shopping mall.

[00:29:37] That's not the place to go get ahealth checkup or Walmart. You can find them in Walmarts to just help.Unbelievable. All right. So what are some questions that we haven't asked andthen we'll get some plugs in, uh, of where, you know, we can learn more, Iassume it's most of your website and articles, or do you have like a, adownload or an email list or something that people can get?

[00:29:58] I have all kinds of stuff.[00:30:00] Yes. There's an email subscriber list you asked before. So.Everything on the sites free, right. And 95% of people that you read progressreports from are doing the free stuff. Like I do investing and I do stocktrading to make money. So this isn't really my, you know, my thing mainly, um,what you said angry.

[00:30:22] I started out as angry and nowI'm just, who knows, but yeah, you can do it for free. There's an email sign upthat takes you through a little seven day. Teach you the basics of biology andsome of the stuff that we talked about and where to go next, it kind of givesyou a basis. I want to be getting them myself.

[00:30:38] Yes. I do have some courses.There's a super simple, basic thing. And then there's a guided more complexthing helps pays the bills, right? Like, so I'm trying not to foot because thisthing has gotten expensive over the years, but an article or whatever, yousaid, a lot of articles that your hosting costs go up.

[00:30:55] If you have traffic across lot,people think internet is like free. Like they don't, they don't, they[00:31:00] understand how the internet works. Like you have to pay every timesomebody clicks on your website, you know, for the most part, I mean, dependingon, and now we're building an app, an iPhone app it's actually alreadyfunctioning.

[00:31:10] It should be out in the next fewweeks. Hopefully we can just hold the phone up to your face. And it would tellyou how strong God says you need or how bad your eyesight is. So you canmeasure your phone. So is it, it gives you a gauge, but then you're not tellingthem to get glasses though, right? You're like basically saying, this is whereyou're at, but this is how you can improve.

[00:31:29] Right. This is like a measure.It's a, it's measuring your eyesight and then based on your measurement,there'll be explanations to help you understand what it means and what you canit, right. So those things cost money lawyers, cost money because me opening mybig fat mouth has gotten me in trouble more than once.

[00:31:45] And this is not super cheap,right? Like, so yeah, free DIY way, which means a little more digging around.And then there's some supported ways. Like if you want to support any Copia. Inthe more serious program I provide support myself. Also, [00:32:00] of course,we also have a big community, all that stuff's free. My main thing is I just,all I want is if you don't want to be wearing glasses, that you can find ananswer, an alternative.

[00:32:11] I'm not trying to push it onpeople. People don't care. The thing that bugs me is if I am really sick ofglasses and I go to an optometrist, I can't find answers. And I go on Googleand I can't find the answer. Yeah. That's the only thing I want is somebodywho's listening to this going. I hate glasses for them to have a starting pointto dig around.

[00:32:28] Yeah, that's great. So I want tobe the devil on the shoulder here real quick. So we've just discussed how thisindustry is ridiculously profitable. Right. And we've also talked about howyou're a stock investor. So let's say we listen to the show and our conclusionwas. These things are so profitable that I want to invest in them, which arethe he's shorting the market.

[00:32:48] And he's trying to take down allthis stuff is happening right now. This podcast is just going to get the wordout there right now. Uh, uh, you know, Warby Parker. I don't know. I don't evenknow if they're [00:33:00] publicly traded right now. Right now. I wouldn'tgive any trading advice right now if we're in a weird freaking time.

[00:33:07] Oh yeah. Just hanging back atthis very moment. A lot of those industries and this niche industries, forexample, Oh man, there's so many. We could talk for hours about all this crazyshit that happens. You get classes, your eyeball gets longer because of yourglasses. And then when you get stronger glasses, your eyeball gets longer.

[00:33:26] It's called axial elongation.Also on Google scholar, what happens is the retina is attached in the backinside of your eyeball. It's not part of it. It's just attached. That goes tobrain. That takes the visual signal, but it's attached. And as the eyeballgrows longer like football shape, that attachment of the retina starts to pullaway.

[00:33:48] So your risk of the retinadetaching or something called lattice degeneration, where parts of it startkind of falling apart, increases dramatically. Dramatically, right? Like wherewas that [00:34:00] at? At minus five, it was like 10 times the risk than if Ididn't need to wear glasses at laser surgery that you absolutely immediatelyneed.

[00:34:09] If you have retinal detachment.Is a two and a half or $3 billion industry at this point also publicly tradedcompanies in there. And if you read their portfolios and if you read their, uh,their shareholder meeting notes, they're excited about the growth of theindustry. Like, what, if you read these things, you're just like, Holy crap,like excited that you, his words, like in broad daylight and this thing is thisthing you can get, you could get written off the attachment for all kinds ofthings.

[00:34:43] No medical advice. I'm not adoctor. All I'm saying is myopia takes the risk of retinol detachment fromalmost nothing to. A lot more than almost nothing. And then you need thatsurgery and people sell machines for that, that make money. And that's agrowing business also [00:35:00] because more people get Milia. So if you werestock trading, I'm not going to give you stock advice, but there's tons oflittle niche industries like that, that are just growing and that are going tocontinue grow.

[00:35:09] Yeah, well, a couple of twoquestions, one statement, and then we're going to let you go. So the onestatement was let's think about the big food and USA and big pharma. Okay. Soyou can look at a graph and you know, you're in the market. You can probablysee these things and look at financial history or whatever, but you can see therise in processed food consumption.

[00:35:30] Uh, the rise in the corporateprofits of food companies and then the rise of pharmaceutical profits. And theyliterally all just like track each other. And then you can also go back all theway to 1900. And you can, in the average, American ate about a pound of sugarand like early 19 hundreds, it's over 135 pounds of sugar a year for theaverage American right now.

[00:35:48] And then again, you can go backand you can track that. So, and then, but, but here's the thing, heart diseasecancer, it all tracks all of them at the same time. Right. So that's why I callaccidental conspiracy because nobody planned it. But what happened [00:36:00]is people got sick from eating crappy mass produced food, subsidized crops,right.

[00:36:05] Then pharmaceuticals, Cray,drugs to kind of mitigate those problems. Right. And then what happens? Youhave selective funding of science. You have suppression of certain researchprojects that don't have a corporate end that get killed all the time. Like ifthey're not, it basically get funded by Coca-Cola or these big companies.

[00:36:22] And if they're not going to findthe result, they want to find they'll kill a study in the middle of the studyand those never get published. Right. So this is just the type of nonsense thatgoes on and anything where you're talking billions of dollars. That's whatpeople need to understand. If somebody is making billions of dollars with thecompany, there's major side effects.

[00:36:39] And I don't care if that'sFacebook, Twitter, Amazon, Google, every company that's making billions ofdollars. Somebody is hurting as a result, some part of the market or a personor an individual, whatever. So people need to just wake up to this stuff. Ifyou're going to blindly trusted doctor by only trust billion dollar markets, basicallyyou might potentially pay the price.

[00:36:57] So that was a statement. Theother, the question was a long [00:37:00] statement. Are there any bookswritten about this? There's tons of books. There's tons of books of like thehistory of this and like that kind of uncover this, or like what, what do theylook like? There's books on how to deal with fixing your eyes.

[00:37:12] Up. There's a lot of them. Iread all of them before I started this thing. Cause I was trying to findanswers. I didn't want to make up find my own. None of them are that great.There, there, isn't a book that I know of that summarizes the whole rise ofmyopia. It's such a weird fringe topic. Like most people just don't care.

[00:37:29] Speaking of your statementthough, Patentable products are incredibly key. Like all this stuff. I talkabout pseudo myopia lens, induced, myopia, axial allegation, all this stuff isin the clinical journals. They have tomatillos doesn't know I have amongst manyother things, a internal sales presentation that was held in Hong Kong with themajor optometry outlets, showing these studies like literally going lensescause [00:38:00] myopia.

[00:38:01] And it's reversible becauseeyeball doesn't only get longer. It also gets shorter that axial change thinggoes in both directions. The only reason I talked about this though, is becausethey introduced a new style of contact lenses that in their design, very thefocal planes to reduce that effect of glasses causing more lost all faith inhumanity.

[00:38:24] Finally, it's gone, but it'shumanity all the way around. Cause it's not their fault. They're just. Part ofa market, right? Like I tell her all the time when people don't care, they'rejust like, ah, contacts, I pop them in and fine. Yes. So I know, I mean, Ihave, I'm, I'm having a lower opinion of all of humanity, but I'm still tryingto help them.

[00:38:42] So that's my saving grace. I canbe mad at people and want to help them at the same time by waking them up. Thefinal question is molecular degeneration, macular. Sorry, molecular. Molecularsounds cool. So macular degeneration, my grandma had that. I remember she wouldsit two feet from the TV, right?

[00:39:00] [00:38:59] Because you got tothe point where she couldn't really see. And she even had to kind of look atthe side of her eye and she would watch TV like that. And if she wanted to lookat us, she would have to look, you have glasses on and she'd look at us thisway. Cause she had better vision that way. And we have to get super close.

[00:39:13] And she was at a point where shehad one of those, you know, old person chairs where they're just like upright.They don't lounge back and she's just sitting two feet from a 40 inch TV to tryto be able to see anything. So, and she smoked and some people like I, forpeople connect that to that. What do you know about, about that condition?

[00:39:28] If it even is one almostnothing. Unfortunately, there's a, there's so many like other eye conditionsand I'm just, just myopia is already. I see. You're eating all my time. A lotof those other things like macular degeneration, I read some studies. Likethere seems to be diet links there, but that was an issue too.

[00:39:46] Yep. But yeah, I didn't reallygo down that rabbit hole because it doesn't right. It doesn't affect mepersonally. And there's already too many rabbit holes, but it seems like dietplays a role. There. Are there other conditions like that wear glasses would be[00:40:00] maybe almost like you have to get them. You know, or is it again,like there's just so many and each one's kind of a case by case like, like, youknow, we, we said, is there a point where some people might need glasses?

[00:40:10] It sounds like most people getit just because they don't want to do the work or, you know, their, their eyesare getting blurry. So they go there and they get them. But it sounds likethere might also be a whole host of, I don't know, are there genetic issueslike you, you know, at the beginning you said it's not genetics, but are theresome that are genetic?

[00:40:25] Like, are there some that areoutside that standard? For sure, absolutely, absolutely, absolutely positivelythere are, but it's a vanishingly small percentage of the population that wearsclasses. Right. So if you go to an ophthalmologist, not an optometrist, anophthalmologist who doesn't sell glasses and you're diagnosed with a condition,right?

[00:40:48] Like that is a, that has X, Y,and Z factors and symptoms and reasons then yes. Right. Like for sure you needglasses, like. For all kinds of things. There's exceptions, right? Mainly[00:41:00] though most people that listen to this, the eyes were fine. And thenwhenever they started going to school or whenever they started being exposed alot to close up, the parents took them to just then they got classes, then theygot strong glasses.

[00:41:13] That's what we're talking about.That's nothing, that's a, a lens subscription that you're. Roped into. Yeah.One more question. I lied. So one more question. Is it true or have you heardor seen those Persian rugs? You know, those really nice, big Persian rugsbecause my grandparents, they actually had those all over the house.

[00:41:31] I've heard that young girls willgo blind, kneeling them. Mostly because they're so up close flowing. Have youheard, have you seen people, like, can you actually go blind just looking atsomething to a close for too long, a period of time? I don't know. I mean,never heard of it. Anything along that line.

[00:41:48] That's crazy. This is weirdfacts that rattled around in my head that I remember somebody said that and I'mlike, wow, that's intense. Oh, I'd have to research it because I don't know. Imean, it's. Extreme cases. A lot of times don't [00:42:00] fall in my thing.Right? Like whenever extreme things happen or out of the range, things happen,I just go, okay, that's not my area because there's a fair amount of those.

[00:42:08] But then the middle of the curveis where most of the, the action here is with myopia. I don't think so, but Idon't, I'm not sure. Well, what was that case? You said that they, they saidtwo to $3 billion industry where it gets up close and then it puts you at riskof like some kind of detachment. Would you go blind in that situation?

[00:42:24] If that happened, you could verywell go blind. Like what happens is the retina, the thing that takes the visualsignal in the back of your eyeball? I mean, that's the thing it's actually partof your brain, not part of your eye, but that thing when it starts toattaching, like, it's like, like it forms like a bubble.

[00:42:41] You have to fix that becauseotherwise the whole thing just continues to attaching and retinal detachment.The way you can tell is all of a sudden it's a super scary in your vision,right? Like you're looking at the screen right now. You start seeing a blackspot, just a whole, just a black, which is black and it starts growing.

[00:42:58] That's why your retinas[00:43:00] detaching, like if you get that kind of symptom, you got to go tothe ER immediately because it can just continue to attaching until the wholething's detached and then it's done the I there's no, currently, as far as Iknow, there's no known fix. If you wait until the whole thing detaches, youstill have it.

[00:43:15] And so that's a by-product ofbeing too nearsighted for long periods of time. It increased be. It can lead tothat increases that. It significantly increases your risk. So maybe that's whyhappens to the person Rutgers, maybe, maybe that's what's happening. Maybe I'm.Now I'm now curious to myself. I want to figure that out.

[00:43:33] So I'll have to research thatJake, this has been a pleasure, man. We appreciate you coming on. We will haveall the links to everything in the show notes. Is there any kind of one finalparting tip of advice or anything that you want to leave the audience with? Thebiggest thing maybe, or this is something I've been really into lately is thescreen addiction bit, right.

[00:43:49] That people don't want to face.And I can use to try to not talk about this at all. But one of the things Irealized is that one of the biggest things that, that takes away from usnevermind [00:44:00] eyesight, right? Like your eyesight gets messed up fromthe screen stuff is we don't get bored right back in the day back when I wasyoung, like there were no phones.

[00:44:08] So you would literally just getbored. And boredom is the seed of being creative. I was just going to say thatcreativity. Yep. They talk about that a lot. Every union. It murders yourcreativity, the phone is killing your creativity. So if you're, if you're like,man, I don't like that. My site is bad, but I'm not super motivated.

[00:44:27] Follow that chain, right. You'readdicted to the phone. And because you're addicted to the phone, you have nomotivation because motivation comes from you feeling discomfort from beingbored. So putting the thing away and letting yourself literally get bored longenough to find something to do is also a great starting point of fixing youreyes.

[00:44:45] Yeah, that's great. And thecontrast principle, you know, there's a reason people become numb to things, orwe have outrage culture because everything is so vanilla. They want to justmake things more extreme, this and that. There's, I mean, psychological issuesthere, you know, that's why meditation, mindfulness is how to search becauseit's needed more than [00:45:00] ever.

[00:45:00] Yeah. I mean, people just needto get outside, get in the sun, look out on long distances, you know, acrossyour field or whatever, and just detach from screens a little bit, but that's agood place to end. Again, Jake. Thanks for my show. We appreciate it. Thank youso much, please always remember that the members of the ancestral mind podcastare not in fact medical professionals.

[00:45:21] They're not doctors, they're notnutritionists. They are simply providing this entertainment for you to do yourown research and to entertain yourselves. So please consult a physician beforechanging your diet. Not everything works for everybody. And make sure youalways do your own research on everything you hear on this show and outside.

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[00:46:44] Continues or gets worse, which alot love the numbers are suggesting. It will then you and your family will beprotected. A lot of my content for my personal brand has been focused on givingpeople the knowledge, the expertise of skills, and just the awareness of someof the craziness that's going on so that they can [00:47:00] protect themselvesso that they can fight back so that they can be simply disobedient so that wecan stymie the ever encroaching spread of government and of corporate.

[00:47:09] And political agenda. If morecitizens do not stand up, fight back, speak up. There's going to be nothingleft to protect. And I don't like fear-mongering and I'm generally optimisticperson, but 2020 has stressed me out at first. It didn't. But then it did. WhenI really saw what was going on. When I read a little bit between the lines andeven now the craziness is continuing and I don't see it letting up any timesoon, the masses are too easily manipulated.

[00:47:32] And so I'm more concerned what'sgonna happen in 2021 when the next flu season comes through and anothercoronavirus is weaponized. And then who knows what's going to happen? Travelrestrictions, mandatory vaccines, chipped, and proud of like cattle. Peoplethink it can't happen. They stick their head down, but they did in Mao's China,they did install Russia.

[00:47:50] They did, and Nazi Germany, andthen it was too late. And who pays the price? It's always, always, always thecitizens. That are having faith and that are just hoping things get better.[00:48:00] They're the ones that always pay the price. So the first thing wecan do is protect yourselves and our family have a plan B, have an escapeoption, and then we can help others head over to call my coach, get on the Mfive newsletter.

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